Nov 4, 2005 18:36
18 yrs ago
1 viewer *
French term
petits biais cousus froncés
French to English
Other
Textiles / Clothing / Fashion
as in last question ...!
Proposed translations
(English)
Proposed translations
+3
2 hrs
French term (edited):
petits biais cousus fronc�s
Selected
(appliqué of) narrow bias binding, gathered and stitched
Sounds a bit as if this might be what you're referring to
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Note added at 2 hrs 5 mins (2005-11-04 20:41:20 GMT)
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I don't think you can use it in the plural, but you might say something like '2 strips of...' etc.
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Note added at 2 hrs 6 mins (2005-11-04 20:42:35 GMT)
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Isn't 'puckered' a word that is used for this kind of finishing?
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Note added at 1 day 4 hrs 17 mins (2005-11-05 22:53:33 GMT)
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What about 'ruched appliqué trim'?
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Note added at 1 day 4 hrs 40 mins (2005-11-05 23:16:25 GMT)
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Rachel: you've got me a bit mystified there!? I didn't say a word about 'piping' (to me, that is something quite different, for which there is a distinct term in FR)
As for the 'froncés' bit, I wondered if 'ruched' wouldn't be a better way to describe it? I'm not too sure of my ground here, but I know that was a term my Mum used to use to describe this sort of thing, though I'm not sure if she was using it accurately or not?
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Note added at 1 day 4 hrs 41 mins (2005-11-05 23:17:47 GMT)
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Well, OED has this to say:
ruche
A n. A frill of gathered ribbon, lace, etc., used esp. as a trimming. E19.
B v.t. Trim with a ruche or ruches. L19.
ruched a. trimmed with a ruche or ruches; gathered into a ruche or ruches: M19.
ruching n. (a) trimming made of ruches M19.
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Note added at 1 day 14 hrs 25 mins (2005-11-06 09:01:40 GMT) Post-grading
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Suezen, in relation to your added notes:
Piping is the sort of edging often found on cushions, upholstery etc., usually sewn into an edge seam, and often incorporating some kind of string/cord 'filler' to produce a rounded effect.
Binding involves wrapping a piece of fabric round the edge of another --- for decorative effect, but also to stop it fraying.
Bias binding is used because it is stretchy, and most importantly, can be stretched to go round bends without wrinkling. It's important to appreciate that 'binding' can refer not only to the process, but also to the actual material itself, which can be bought ready made, and usually has the form of a strip or 'ribbon' of material (cut on the bias, of course), and folded round on itself on each side to form a flat 'tube' that has an open seam down the back. All this makes it easy to apply folded round an edge, or set into a seam (with or without a filler) for piping. But it is also sometimes used in its own right, flat, as a decorative item, as an alternative to ribbon, and more suitable for application where curves may be required.
HOWEVER, I have noted that in French haberdashery, the term is sometimes used somewhat loosely to apply to other kinds of 'braid' or 'trim', and I suddenly wondered if this whole 'froncé' bit isn't in fact referring to that narrow, 'wavy' braiding that was dreadfully fashionable at one time, and which I think may have come back again --- the sort of thing that goes with gingham and smocking (quel horreur !)
I could see how someone might describe it (inaccurately) as 'biais', and it would almost certainly be sewn on, but would be different from something 'gathered' or 'ruched'
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Note added at 2 hrs 5 mins (2005-11-04 20:41:20 GMT)
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I don't think you can use it in the plural, but you might say something like '2 strips of...' etc.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs 6 mins (2005-11-04 20:42:35 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Isn't 'puckered' a word that is used for this kind of finishing?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 4 hrs 17 mins (2005-11-05 22:53:33 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
What about 'ruched appliqué trim'?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 4 hrs 40 mins (2005-11-05 23:16:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Rachel: you've got me a bit mystified there!? I didn't say a word about 'piping' (to me, that is something quite different, for which there is a distinct term in FR)
As for the 'froncés' bit, I wondered if 'ruched' wouldn't be a better way to describe it? I'm not too sure of my ground here, but I know that was a term my Mum used to use to describe this sort of thing, though I'm not sure if she was using it accurately or not?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 4 hrs 41 mins (2005-11-05 23:17:47 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Well, OED has this to say:
ruche
A n. A frill of gathered ribbon, lace, etc., used esp. as a trimming. E19.
B v.t. Trim with a ruche or ruches. L19.
ruched a. trimmed with a ruche or ruches; gathered into a ruche or ruches: M19.
ruching n. (a) trimming made of ruches M19.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 14 hrs 25 mins (2005-11-06 09:01:40 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------
Suezen, in relation to your added notes:
Piping is the sort of edging often found on cushions, upholstery etc., usually sewn into an edge seam, and often incorporating some kind of string/cord 'filler' to produce a rounded effect.
Binding involves wrapping a piece of fabric round the edge of another --- for decorative effect, but also to stop it fraying.
Bias binding is used because it is stretchy, and most importantly, can be stretched to go round bends without wrinkling. It's important to appreciate that 'binding' can refer not only to the process, but also to the actual material itself, which can be bought ready made, and usually has the form of a strip or 'ribbon' of material (cut on the bias, of course), and folded round on itself on each side to form a flat 'tube' that has an open seam down the back. All this makes it easy to apply folded round an edge, or set into a seam (with or without a filler) for piping. But it is also sometimes used in its own right, flat, as a decorative item, as an alternative to ribbon, and more suitable for application where curves may be required.
HOWEVER, I have noted that in French haberdashery, the term is sometimes used somewhat loosely to apply to other kinds of 'braid' or 'trim', and I suddenly wondered if this whole 'froncé' bit isn't in fact referring to that narrow, 'wavy' braiding that was dreadfully fashionable at one time, and which I think may have come back again --- the sort of thing that goes with gingham and smocking (quel horreur !)
I could see how someone might describe it (inaccurately) as 'biais', and it would almost certainly be sewn on, but would be different from something 'gathered' or 'ruched'
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Jane Lamb-Ruiz (X)
: no Dusty..binding is a completel no go..it's trim not binding, I have never seen women's clothes with the term "binding"...sorry
15 mins
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Thanks, Jane! But isn't bias binding a special sort of trim? I know exactly the sort of thing Suezen is describing.
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agree |
emiledgar
: appliques sounds good to me...
10 hrs
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Thanks, Emiledgar!
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agree |
Jennifer White
: I think you are right despite what Jane says. Bias binding is used a lot on women's clothes.
18 hrs
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Thanks, Jennifer! I thought it was; I'm sure Jane doesn't move in such lowly circles as I do... ;-))
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agree |
Rachel Fell
: I agree, there are bias binding material appliqued frill type things - not proper frills (-;) ), and a bit tatty-looking, but bias binding doesn't sound v.nice as a decoration detail\\What's happened to the "froncés"- http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1175387
1 day 1 hr
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Thanks, Rachel! As you say, 'bias binding' doesn't sound all that appealing, I wonder just HOW important that 'bias...' is; perhaps Jane's 'trim' would suffice. // Ta, I hadn't looked at previous Q.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "It was very difficult to choose as you were all so helpful here. particular thanks to Jane for making me smile in the middle of my stress and Rachel for her research. Yes, Dusty, it was for a woman's shirt front made by a designer who used gathered bias binding (as well as numerous other intriguing additions + ruffles and frills).
"
+1
16 mins
French term (edited):
petits biais cousus fronc�s
small bias bindings sewn and gathered
there must be a better way of putting it
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Note added at 16 mins (2005-11-04 18:52:56 GMT)
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stitched coulc do instead of sewn
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Note added at 16 mins (2005-11-04 18:53:06 GMT)
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coulD!!!
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Note added at 16 mins (2005-11-04 18:52:56 GMT)
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stitched coulc do instead of sewn
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Note added at 16 mins (2005-11-04 18:53:06 GMT)
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coulD!!!
Peer comment(s):
agree |
RHELLER
: yes, bias binding is correct see lexique: http://christine.patchwork-online.net/lexique.htm
19 hrs
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merci Rita
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+1
51 mins
French term (edited):
petits biais cousus fronc�s
little gathered, stitched strips of bias-cut fabric
sugg.
Peer comment(s):
agree |
Jane Lamb-Ruiz (X)
: yes strips..if they go vertically, they are not bindings for heaven's sake....have you ever seen a shirt with bindings?? :)
1 day 25 mins
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Thanks, Jane:)
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52 mins
French term (edited):
petits biais cousus fronc�s
narrow, gathered bias-cut inset panels
is what it seems like..running from top to bottom...
gathered insets...
check it out:
... ***Insets of matching eyelet lace on collar and around yoke ... panel and silver pin to keep top panel in place ... Frilly Cowgirl Shirt Bright white women’s shirt with ...
www.esells.com/ecitemlist11. asp?CO=RW&CMD=CAT&Cat=243 - 101k - Supplemental Result - Cached - Similar pages
I think we say it differently in English...the biais is either biais strip insets or gathered inset panels running vertically on the biais
and no bindings...:)
2004 2005 Fashion Designer Top Trends Autumn Winter 2004-2005Top Fashion Designer Fashion Show Trends For Fall/Autumn 2004/Winter 2005 ... and ***semi opaque sexy inset fabric panels that emphasised body contours****. ...
www.fashion-era.com/Trends/fashion_ trends_05_globaldesigners_autumn_2004_winter_2005.htm - 67k - Cached - Similar pages
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Note added at 52 mins (2005-11-04 19:28:55 GMT)
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OK: with gathered, sewn-on strips cut on the biais
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Note added at 2 hrs 20 mins (2005-11-04 20:56:37 GMT)
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gathered bias strips
gathered insets...
check it out:
... ***Insets of matching eyelet lace on collar and around yoke ... panel and silver pin to keep top panel in place ... Frilly Cowgirl Shirt Bright white women’s shirt with ...
www.esells.com/ecitemlist11. asp?CO=RW&CMD=CAT&Cat=243 - 101k - Supplemental Result - Cached - Similar pages
I think we say it differently in English...the biais is either biais strip insets or gathered inset panels running vertically on the biais
and no bindings...:)
2004 2005 Fashion Designer Top Trends Autumn Winter 2004-2005Top Fashion Designer Fashion Show Trends For Fall/Autumn 2004/Winter 2005 ... and ***semi opaque sexy inset fabric panels that emphasised body contours****. ...
www.fashion-era.com/Trends/fashion_ trends_05_globaldesigners_autumn_2004_winter_2005.htm - 67k - Cached - Similar pages
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Note added at 52 mins (2005-11-04 19:28:55 GMT)
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OK: with gathered, sewn-on strips cut on the biais
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Note added at 2 hrs 20 mins (2005-11-04 20:56:37 GMT)
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gathered bias strips
Discussion
For bias binding
shopping.msn.com/results/shp/?bCatId=8328,av=2-4200226 - 67k
www.designandsew.com/patterns.html - 53k
For trim
www.velvetgarden.net/tanks.html - 53k
For piping
Binding is a way of neatening a raw edge using a separate length of fabric, usually in a contrasting colour.
Piping is a way to emphasize a seam or edge and can add strength to corners that might receive a lot of wear.
For both binding and piping strips of fabric cut on the bias are used as this makes them slightly stretchy.
www.alternative-windows.com/binding.htm - 30k
I also found piping trim, bias piping ...
Many thanks again for all your help. Have a good weekend.
cousus fronc�s means gathered ..it can be that style there is now which I don't even know how to say in English..but binding is not right. MAybe it will come to me..