| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Client publishes translation without paying for it Thread poster: Jennifer Richmond
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I have translated a work of fiction for a client but only received a partial payment and the client still owns me $1400 and ignores reminders.
The client is in the US. Is is my understanding that I hold the copyright for that part of the translation I have not been paid for, since I had been hired to do the translation. The book will be released on Amazon on the 15th and was #1 in Best Sellers in Kindle Store.
My current plan is to buy a copy to compare against my tran... See more I have translated a work of fiction for a client but only received a partial payment and the client still owns me $1400 and ignores reminders.
The client is in the US. Is is my understanding that I hold the copyright for that part of the translation I have not been paid for, since I had been hired to do the translation. The book will be released on Amazon on the 15th and was #1 in Best Sellers in Kindle Store.
My current plan is to buy a copy to compare against my translation and then report a copyright violation.
Has anyone been in this situation and can help? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Sadek_A 
Local time: 07:32
English to Arabic
+ ...
You don't wait.
You immediately contact Amazon's PR & Legal Depts, attaching a copy of (1)the PO, (2)the cleared partial amount and (3)the unanswered reminders.
Your email to them must be formatted in a legal language, warning them that they could become jointly liable for the infringement.
Ask them to nudge the broker/publisher, or cease that publication.
If you have no PO, then your ground might be less solid.
| | | | Dmitrij_1980 (X)
Russian Federation
Russian to German
[Edited at 2021-02-06 13:04 GMT]
| | | | | What I would do | Feb 6, 2021 |
If your work hasn't been paid, then I'm pretty sure you own the copyright. Depending on your contract, you may even remain the owner of the copyright after payment.
I would notify the client in writing (email + recorded letter) that unless you have received full payment 8 days from now, plus a late fee, you will report this copyright infringement to Amazon, which would most likely take down the book from sale to avoid a lawsuit, and that in addition, you will take legal steps to rec... See more If your work hasn't been paid, then I'm pretty sure you own the copyright. Depending on your contract, you may even remain the owner of the copyright after payment.
I would notify the client in writing (email + recorded letter) that unless you have received full payment 8 days from now, plus a late fee, you will report this copyright infringement to Amazon, which would most likely take down the book from sale to avoid a lawsuit, and that in addition, you will take legal steps to recover this debt, which could add further costs to this 'client'.
And please do report this miserable outfit in the Blue Board and, if you have an account, at www.paymentpractices.net, so the rest of us can steer clear of these thieves.
Amazon copyright infringement report links:
https://www.amazon.com/report/infringement
https://www.amazon.co.uk/report/infringement
https://www.amazon.de/report/infringement ▲ Collapse
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Jennifer Richmond
Norway
Local time: 04:32
Member (2018)
Spanish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Work for hire through Upwork | Feb 6, 2021 |
I did it as work for hire through Upwork. The client could only fund part of the work due to a fault in the system. But it was not the first time we worked together so I trusted her. I would have cut the losses but since she has decided to use my work I need to take actions.
I have informed Upwork about the situation to make sure other freelancers do not make the same experience.
I have prepared my report to Amazon but need to make sure that the published translation is indeed... See more I did it as work for hire through Upwork. The client could only fund part of the work due to a fault in the system. But it was not the first time we worked together so I trusted her. I would have cut the losses but since she has decided to use my work I need to take actions.
I have informed Upwork about the situation to make sure other freelancers do not make the same experience.
I have prepared my report to Amazon but need to make sure that the published translation is indeed my translation.
I have messaged the client multiple times but she keeps ignoring me. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Bad faith from the start? | Feb 6, 2021 |
Jennifer Richmond wrote:
The client could only fund part of the work due to a fault in the system. But it was not the first time we worked together so I trusted her.
How do you know there was a fault in the system? Can you be sure she wasn't lying about that? Because I have come across people who will pay for the first 1-2 jobs to gain your trust, and will then try to avoid paying you for part or all of a much bigger job after that, in the hope that you'll believe in their good faith and not pursue the matter for that reason. I wonder whether the partial payment for this latest job was made to convince you she isn't a scammer.
| | | | Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 03:32
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
| A PO gives no benefit | Feb 6, 2021 |
Sadek_A wrote:
If you have no PO, then your ground might be less solid.
No, if there is no PO then there should be an exchange of emails that will clearly show that the client retained the services of the translator. That's worth as much in a court of law as a PO.
| | | | Jennifer Richmond
Norway
Local time: 04:32
Member (2018)
Spanish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | The system does not allow funding multiple milestones | Feb 6, 2021 |
Peter Shortall wrote:
Jennifer Richmond wrote:
The client could only fund part of the work due to a fault in the system. But it was not the first time we worked together so I trusted her.
How do you know there was a fault in the system? Can you be sure she wasn't lying about that? Because I have come across people who will pay for the first 1-2 jobs to gain your trust, and will then try to avoid paying you for part or all of a much bigger job after that, in the hope that you'll believe in their good faith and not pursue the matter for that reason. I wonder whether the partial payment for this latest job was made to convince you she isn't a scammer.
I know because I know the system.
You can create as many milestones as you like but only one can be funded and activated. She created enough milestones but once I handed over the work she first offered to pay less than the agreed price claiming expenses on her side which are non of my business and then ghosted me.
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Jennifer Richmond
Norway
Local time: 04:32
Member (2018)
Spanish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Need proof that this is really my work. | Feb 6, 2021 |
Sadek_A wrote:
You don't wait.
You immediately contact Amazon's PR & Legal Depts, attaching a copy of (1)the PO, (2)the cleared partial amount and (3)the unanswered reminders.
Your email to them must be formatted in a legal language, warning them that they could become jointly liable for the infringement.
Ask them to nudge the broker/publisher, or cease that publication.
If you have no PO, then your ground might be less solid.
My first problem is that I cannot claim that this is my translation without seeing it. I doubt that she would have paid someone else to create another translation yet it is possible.
You you have a sample using legal language?
| | | | | Waiting before striking | Feb 6, 2021 |
Jennifer Richmond wrote:
She created enough milestones but once I handed over the work she first offered to pay less than the agreed price claiming expenses on her side which are non of my business and then ghosted me.
Not being familiar with Upwork, I'm afraid I don't know what a milestone is or how this amounts to a fault in the system, but you needn't explain it to me; her bad faith is already abundantly clear from her unwillingness to honour the agreement and the disappearing act. I think it underlines the point that not all scammers strike straight away; some will pay for a small job or two first to gain our trust, in the hope that we'll believe their excuses and not retaliate when they try to get away with not paying for a bigger job later. This is a point I mention near the end of my ProZ article about the subject of scammer psychology (if anyone's interested, it can be accessed from the "Author" link at the top of my profile page - shameless plug, I know  ).
I hope you will be successful in recovering the money you're owed.
[Edited at 2021-02-06 16:29 GMT]
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Jennifer Richmond wrote:
My first problem is that I cannot claim that this is my translation without seeing it. I doubt that she would have paid someone else to create another translation yet it is possible.
I wouldn't bother so much about that right now. Amazon can look into it once you have told them about the issue.
Jennifer Richmond wrote:
You you have a sample using legal language?
This is not necessary with a big company like Amazon. They know perfectly well what things like this are about and don't need you to explain it to them in 'legal language'. Just use one of the online forms and follow the directions, but do give your 'client' a final warning first.
Whenever I have complained to web hosting companies and other about content that had been stolen from one of my websites and illegally published by someone else, they have acted quickly and taken such sites down until the owner had removed the stolen content, as they could be held liable and don’t want any such trouble.
| | | | Adieu
Ukrainian to English
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| Just report them to upwork and amazon both | Feb 6, 2021 |
And the upwork job IS the purchase order, pretty much.
Don't wait and don't consider their explanations one bit.
[Edited at 2021-02-06 17:28 GMT]
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Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 04:32
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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Sadek_A wrote:
1. You immediately contact Amazon's PR & Legal Depts...
2. Your email to them must be formatted in a legal language,...
3. ...warning them that they could become jointly liable for the infringement.
I disagree with all three of these statements.
1. Amazon has a ready-to-use copyright complaint procedure. You're likely to get the swiftest response if you follow Amazon's preferred channels. See here and here.
2. Unless you're a legal expert, the last thing you should do is to attempt to use legal language. It is much more important that you communicate your complaint clearly and simply. The problem with legal language is although you may think that your missive sounds like a legal notice, you may end up using the wrong terminology, which would result in them getting the wrong message.
3. Do not make threats unless you are certain that your threat is good. Adding words like "could" or "possibly" to a threat is not a good enough excuse to get away with making unfounded claims in a threat. Also, if you include a threat, the recipient might choose to escalate the request to someone more senior in the legal department, which may result in delays. Or worse, if the senior person decides that your threat has no merit and rejects it, then the valid portion of your complaint may end up getting lost in the process, too.
Jennifer Richmond wrote:
It is my understanding that I hold the copyright for that part of the translation I have not been paid for...
I'm not 100% sure about this. After all, if you buy a chair, then the chair is yours even if you haven't fully paid for it yet. However, I still think you should use Amazon's copyright infringement form and give it a try.
The book will be released on Amazon on the 15th and was #1 in Best Sellers in Kindle Store.
I don't understand Amazon, so perhaps this is a stupid question, but: how can a book be a #1 best seller before it is published? And if the book is already in Kindle Store, can't you buy it already?
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 04:32
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
| Maybe translation. | Feb 6, 2021 |
The book will be released on Amazon on the 15th and was #1 in Best Sellers in Kindle Store.
I don't understand Amazon, so perhaps this is a stupid question, but: how can a book be a #1 best seller before it is published? And if the book is already in Kindle Store, can't you buy it already?
Perhaps the book was a best seller in the original, source language. Usually bestsellers are being translated into other languages. Less popular books don’t.
Maybe the book in German or on DE Amazon will be released on the 15th.
Question: Was this project carried out directly with the author or through an agent?
[Edited at 2021-02-06 17:44 GMT]
| | | | Sadek_A
Local time: 07:32
English to Arabic
+ ...
Sheila Wilson wrote:
A PO gives no benefit
No, if there is no PO then there should be an exchange of emails that will clearly show that the client retained the services of the translator. That's worth as much in a court of law as a PO.
It is feeling more and more that my legal knowledge is being tested, for some unannounced reason!
Anyway, a skilled lawyer can immediately claim (1) hacked email, (2) routed email, (3) spoofed/mimicked email, (4) unauthorized communication by an unidentified insider, or (5) having commissioned, received and paid for only a part not a whole, consequently pushing before court for gullibility on the plaintiff's part and throwing her into a maze of technicalities.
However, with the inclusion of a PO that is (1) signed by authorized signatory, (2) stamped with entity's official seal, and (3) printed-out on entity's official letterhead, even that skilled lawyer will get cornered beyond escape.
Care to poke more holes, in attempt to talk your fellow translators out of ever asking for PO?
I have always noticed this about you, where they are led into a bumpier road.
I don't know the OP, nor do I have any stake with her; still, I gave her the best course of action I would give myself!
Jennifer Richmond wrote:
Need proof that this is really my work.
My first problem is that I cannot claim that this is my translation without seeing it. I doubt that she would have paid someone else to create another translation yet it is possible.
You you have a sample using legal language?
You are, unfortunately, rendering your case invalid now. If you didn't have a lead in the first place, then why have you been screening Amazon and coming here asking for an action-plan?
Did you manage, by whatever means, to know that your client is the exact same entity publishing the work on Amazon? If not, then the whole thing (your questions and concerns, our answers and tactics) is a bust.
The legal language bit is actually your homework, but okay here is something:
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Dear Amazon Legal & PR Depts,
This is to serve as a notice of a soon-to-occur infringement by one of the publishers [name] on your website.
The indicated party contacted me on [date] requiring written translation of [content] from [SL] to [TL], where the communication cultivated into issuing me a legit PO on [date] to the same effect mutually agreed on by both parties. Upon my successful delivery of the complete, accurate translation through the same channel of previous communication with that party, they unilaterally chose to downrate the mutually-agreed, POed fee, ultimately transferring only a fraction [paid amount] of the POed amount [total amount]. All my attempts reaching out to said party for amicable clearing of outstandings [owed amount] were met with dead silence on their part. Given that the indicated party is firmly scheduled to publish on Amazon that partially-unpaid translation of mine without any clear plan to settle said outstandings, I resultantly find myself forced to take legal action to the maximum extent permitted by law against said party, as well as against Amazon in the odd case of Amazon's failure to properly cease publication of that hijacked translation.
[exhibits of PO, relevant incoming & outgoing emails included for your legal consideration]
Standing by for your follow-up on the issue, and welcoming your inquiries if any.
Kind regards,
-------
That said, since you clearly have no PO and possibly no direct email contact, I'm sorry to say you will not be able to prove anything. But, you can chase UpWork for action.
And, I will appreciate if no one else drags me into further debate, as I have things to attend to!
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