Jun 2, 2016 18:24
8 yrs ago
Dutch term

Kranige kruidragers

Dutch to English Medical Medical (general) mental health
Hello everybody!

these are definitions to identify various degree lunatics

Vrijzinnige vrijbuiters – chronic psychotic , reject medicine
Kranige kruidragers – schizophrenia, heavy burden for others
Standvastige strijders – in constant opposition to others, encounters are short and not of any impact
Verkommerden en verloederden

please help!
References
fyi

Discussion

katerina turevich (asker) Jun 11, 2016:
@ writeaway Hi! Could you please post 'crucifer' as an answer?. I am most likely going to do 'bold crucifer', but you can do what you like. There will be a clarification following anyway, so that there will be no doubt about the meaning. Great thanks for the lead!
freekfluweel Jun 3, 2016:
@MB... ... and there are over 35 million Ghits for 'purple grass'...
Michael Beijer Jun 3, 2016:
for freek: regarding your statement about the concept of a "Christ figure":

"No, it's not, it refers to someone (Messiah) who can do miracles. Positive connotation only!"

have a google:

"themes of sacrifice and suffering, underscoring the role of I-330 as the Christ-figure"
"Christ figure as stigmatized figure whose suffering is redemptive ..."
"This Christ is a man who suffers pain in a ..."
"As a Christ figure, the suffering servant has been identified with humanity's suffering throughout history."
"Thus it is the redemptive nature of the Christ-figure's suffering that makes their ..... so too does suffering define the experiences of Dostoevsky's Christ-figures."
"The tendency to identify with Jesus in our suffering not only leads at times ... "
"...back for the guilty by carrying the load of all who suffer with them and even for ... "
etc.
Michael Beijer Jun 3, 2016:
@Lianne: I really like your suggestion: "courageous cross-bearers"

(thanks, btw, for the Neutral, rather than the Disagree)
Michael Beijer Jun 3, 2016:
not sure how/why the author chose "kruidrager" based on:

"de kranige kruisdragers, die ernstige psychiatrische handicaps hebben en beperktc mogelijkhcden. Het gaat om mensen mct schizofrenic. Omdat zc vaak ängstig zijn en door vele psychotische bclcvingcn achterdochtig geworden, functioneren zij siecht in de samenlcving. Ze hebben mecr-voudige hulpvragen en zijn op velerlei terreinen afhankelijk van anderen. Familie en verdere omgeving worden zwaar belast met de vele problemen en trekken zich terug."

as it is the "Familie en verdere omgeving" who are belast, rather than the patient
so it is the family who must bear the burden, not the patient.

I suppose that schizophrenia is a heavy cross to bear for the person suffering from it, but that it also entails a very heavy burden on the caregiver, so in that sense, everyone bears the burden.
freekfluweel Jun 3, 2016:
bold burden-bearers ...
based on KB's ref
.
freekfluweel Jun 3, 2016:
'ieder huis heeft zijn kruis' ...

Imo 'kruisdrager' shouldn't be taken literally...
katerina turevich (asker) Jun 3, 2016:
clinical characteristics Kranige kruisdragers –People with serious psychiatric disorders and intellectual disabilities. highly limited in their capacity. These are schizophrenics. They function badly in society because they often experience fear and/or psychotic episodes. They require multi-faceted care, and are dependent on others in too many aspects. Family and friends tend to feel overburdened by their presence, and take a step back.

Michael Beijer Jun 2, 2016:
thus Vrijzinnige vrijbuiters
Kranige kruidragers
Standvastige strijders

=

Freethinking freebooters
Cross-bearing Christ figures
Quarrelsome combatants
Michael Beijer Jun 2, 2016:
ha ha, this is fun how about:

"cross-bearing Christ figures" ;-)
katerina turevich (asker) Jun 2, 2016:
yes, a typo kranige kruisdragers

thanks!
TDVTrans Jun 2, 2016:
Not a typo? I don't think kruidrager exists in Dutch. I think it should be 'kruisdrager'. I could be wrong though since I don't have a Van Dale dictionary handy.

Proposed translations

8 days
Selected

crucifers

Van Dale Nl-En
also see ref below
Peer comment(s):

neutral Michael Beijer : not sure many of katerina's readers will know what the word "crucifer" means, or will get the link to a "vegetative state". had to look 'em up myself. also, "bold (vegetative) crucifers", doesn't really float my boat, but I expect you already knew that ;)
39 mins
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Many thanks! the association with a "vegetative state" doesn't hurt."
2 hrs

cross-bearing Christ figures

No idea if it's any good or what you're looking for, but it made me smile, so I thought I'd enter it into the competition.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2016-06-02 21:25:59 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christ_figure

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 days (2016-06-11 14:16:04 GMT)
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PS: I don't think many readers will know what the word "crucifer" means, so don't think "bold crucifers" will work. crucifer reminds me of conifer, but then again, what do I know about performing translation miracles?
Example sentence:

In this landscape of moors, sandy roads and small cottages with straw rooftops, we see a procession of poor peasants and in their midst a cross-bearing Christ figure.

Peer comment(s):

neutral Lianne van de Ven : I would not use 'figure' here, rather something like brave cross-bearer or brave/courageous crucifer (writeaway's suggestion). I think the Dutch wording is meant to empathize with this person's fate.
5 hrs
yeah, I was wondering what to do with "kranig", and in what way these patients were "kranig". spirited? "brave/courageous cross-bearers" isn't bad, but I am not sure many people will know what the word "crucifer" means.
Something went wrong...

Reference comments

6 hrs
Reference:

fyi

Mon Van Genechten (1903-1974): Flemish Missionary and Chinese ...
https://books.google.com/books?isbn=9058672220
Lorry Swerts, ‎Koen De Ridder - 2002 - ‎Art
In this landscape of moors, sandy roads and small cottages with straw rooftops, we see a procession of poor peasants and in their midst a cross-bearing Christ ...

Van Dale Nl-En:
kruisdrager de (m.) (rooms-katholiek)
crucifer
(figuurlijk ook) cross-bearer
Peer comments on this reference comment:

neutral Michael Beijer : not sure what your ref is meant to say. I know what kruisdrager / cross-bearer / person person bearing/carrying a cross means
6 hrs
Something went wrong...
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