Mar 5, 2007 18:01
17 yrs ago
3 viewers *
Ukrainian term
query re Ukraine cities
Ukrainian to English
Other
International Org/Dev/Coop
I'm editing a text about education in Ukraine, and this is a section referring to the devolution of management and funding of education .......
"initially to the three pilot regions, the City of Kyiv, KHarkiv, Lviv with a possible expansion to ..."
I'm a bit confused with the punctuation and the "City of", and wondering whether Kyiv is Kiev...
So, my Q is:
are these 3 different cities?
are these names OK in English?
TIA:-)
"initially to the three pilot regions, the City of Kyiv, KHarkiv, Lviv with a possible expansion to ..."
I'm a bit confused with the punctuation and the "City of", and wondering whether Kyiv is Kiev...
So, my Q is:
are these 3 different cities?
are these names OK in English?
TIA:-)
Proposed translations
(English)
| 4 +1 | Official Ukrainian spellings: Kyiv, Kharkiv, Lviv |
David Knowles
|
| 5 +1 | 3 different cities |
Vanda Nissen
|
| 4 +2 | explanation |
Sofiya Skachko
|
| 3 | see... |
Kirill Semenov
|
Proposed translations
+1
8 mins
David Knowles
Native in English
Works in field
Specialist in Civil Law & Contracts
Native in: English 
Works in: Russian to English, English, Ukrainian to English
Related KudoZ points
:
4
Selected
Official Ukrainian spellings: Kyiv, Kharkiv, Lviv
But they are commonly known by their Russian equivalents: Kiev, Kharkov and Lvov. However, in particular you may offend the residents of Lviv if you call it Lvov!
Depends what you are translating and why. Kiev in particular is a very common spelling.
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Note added at 11 mins (2007-03-05 18:13:11 GMT)
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Looking back at your question, I'd put the "cities" of Kyiv, Kharkiv and Lviv. If you want to be really fussy, you can put L'viv!
Depends what you are translating and why. Kiev in particular is a very common spelling.
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Note added at 11 mins (2007-03-05 18:13:11 GMT)
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Looking back at your question, I'd put the "cities" of Kyiv, Kharkiv and Lviv. If you want to be really fussy, you can put L'viv!
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Kirill Semenov
: Sure, David, you've been there, seen that :) + And it'd be great if you visit us again, waiting for this :) Please consider the end of May, it's the best time, you will see Kiev in its best!
1 min
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Hi Kirill - won't be this May I'm afraid! You'll have to make do with some Ukrainian questions I'm going to post!
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks V. much to the Ukrainian community for the help:-) It was difficult to choose an answer, but it was (very) marginally more useful than the others:-)"
+1
7 mins
Vanda Nissen
Australia
Australia
Specializes in field
Australia
PhD in Linguistics, NAATI certified
Native in: Russian
Works in: English to Russian, Danish to Russian, Russian to English, and 5 more.
3 different cities
Kyiv, Kharkiv, Lviv
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Note added at 9 mins (2007-03-05 18:10:48 GMT)
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Yes, Kyiv means Kiev, just Kyiv reflects Ukrainian spelling and Kiev -the Russian one, both variants are used
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Note added at 9 mins (2007-03-05 18:10:48 GMT)
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Yes, Kyiv means Kiev, just Kyiv reflects Ukrainian spelling and Kiev -the Russian one, both variants are used
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Vladimir Dubisskiy
: simple and clear explanation
6 mins
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Спасибо большое, Владимир!:)
|
9 mins
Kirill Semenov
Ukraine
Ukraine
Ukraine
60+ books translated and published
Native in: Russian
Works in: English to Russian, Russian
see...
`Cities of Kyiv, Kharkiv, Lviv are perfectly OK'.
It means that the project trying to embrace not only the town itself, but also ist suburbs, which are huge.
Just to let you know: Kyiv=Kiev (you're perfectly right) is the 2nd largest city in the former USSR, and it's almost 3.5-4 millions population now. Just don't take it easily, it's a huge city.
It means that the project trying to embrace not only the town itself, but also ist suburbs, which are huge.
Just to let you know: Kyiv=Kiev (you're perfectly right) is the 2nd largest city in the former USSR, and it's almost 3.5-4 millions population now. Just don't take it easily, it's a huge city.
+2
12 mins
Sofiya Skachko
Denmark
Denmark
Native in Ukrainian
Denmark
Festina lente
Native in: Ukrainian
Works in: Ukrainian to English, English to Ukrainian, Russian to English, and 2 more.
explanation
the names of the cities are correct
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Note added at 40 mins (2007-03-05 18:41:59 GMT)
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I have entered forum discussions regarding "Kiev" before. I'm glad that "the" in front of Ukraine is dropped now in most cases (although it's a long and tiring project to convince people in different spheres that it's sensible and respectful towards an independent Ukraine). It will probably take even longer to regulate the spellings of the cities. Why do I think this should be done? At least for the sake of simplicity and efficiency. So that when I'm booking an airline online I know which spelling to type in, and don't have to try out Kyiv, Kiev, Kyїv, Kyyiv.
I'm glad David Knowles above indicated "official Ukrainian spellings," and I really hope it will slowly pick up in media, politics, academic discourse.
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Note added at 40 mins (2007-03-05 18:41:59 GMT)
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I have entered forum discussions regarding "Kiev" before. I'm glad that "the" in front of Ukraine is dropped now in most cases (although it's a long and tiring project to convince people in different spheres that it's sensible and respectful towards an independent Ukraine). It will probably take even longer to regulate the spellings of the cities. Why do I think this should be done? At least for the sake of simplicity and efficiency. So that when I'm booking an airline online I know which spelling to type in, and don't have to try out Kyiv, Kiev, Kyїv, Kyyiv.
I'm glad David Knowles above indicated "official Ukrainian spellings," and I really hope it will slowly pick up in media, politics, academic discourse.
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Kirill Semenov
: I can't agree with this. At least, the names are under heated discussions; in the worst case, you're wrong
8 mins
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Кириле, дякую, я слідкую за дискусією
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| agree |
Mihailolja
: More than for simplicity the names of these cities as all in Ukraine deserve to be spelt in their Ukrainian spelling ;-)
24 mins
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thank you
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| agree |
Vassyl Trylis
: Me also of those sensible...
48 mins
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дякую :-)
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| neutral |
David Knowles
: I understand the feelings, but Kiev in particular is so familiar and Kyiv looks so strange that it's hard to change attitudes.//For anything approaching official translations I agree. For informal conversations/emails, I think I'll stick to Kiev!
50 mins
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It should be a mutual effort, of course, to change attitudes. And I think translators should play a role in this.
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Discussion