Glossary entry (derived from question below)
German term or phrase:
Doktor Juris
English translation:
Doctor in Law(s)
Added to glossary by
Derek Gill Franßen
Oct 19, 2004 19:14
19 yrs ago
10 viewers *
German term
Dirk Lobenbruck
Doktor Juris
German to English
Law/Patents
Law (general)
can i translated the degree dr. jur. into J.D. (used in the US as Juris Doctor)?
Proposed translations
(English)
| 5 | Doctor in Laws |
Derek Gill Franßen
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| 4 +4 | I'd say yes. |
Prishtina
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| 4 +4 | Doctor of Laws (LLD) |
Edith Kelly
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| 5 +1 | Juris Doctor |
Andras Malatinszky
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Proposed translations
3 hrs
Derek Gill Franßen
Germany
Germany
Native in English
Specializes in field
Germany
German Attorney & University Lecturer
Native in: English
Works in: German to English, English, English to German, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
728
German term (edited):
Dr. jur. = Doktor in Recht
Selected
Doctor in Laws
Please take a look in the middle of this link and tell me that a German "Dr. jur." is the same thing as an American "J.D.". I tell you, no way! A law student does NOT have to write a thesis. It doesn't matter so much about what came first or last - it is possible to get a PhD before a Masters in America too. What matters is the gnarly "thesis" that Doktoren (=PhD candidates) have to write; if you don't don't do that then you aren't a "Dr." = "PhD" (IMHO). :-)
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Note added at 3 hrs 19 mins (2004-10-19 22:33:58 GMT)
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Sorry, I got carried away, the link: http://www.payscale.com/salary-survey/aid-29713/raname-SALAR... ;-)
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Note added at 3 hrs 45 mins (2004-10-19 22:59:51 GMT) Post-grading
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Thanks, but I think you are wrong about a German \"Dr. jur.\" not having to write a thesis.
I have just (less than a month ago) passed the second of both state exams (after two years of post-graduate legal clerkship) and am now a German attorney and (if I were a German citizen) could become a judge, but I am not a \"Dr. jur.\".
If I wanted to become a \"Dr. jur.\", I would have to (and still could) find a \"Doktorvater\", with whom I would decide upon a theme for my \"Doktorarbeit\" = \"thesis\". At the end there would be a so-called \"Rigorosum\", which is basically a huge oral exam. And then to top it all off, the thing would have to be published (\"für ein Heidengeld\"). Then, and only then, would I be entitled to carry the title of \"Dr. jur.\" (see \"Dissertation\" in this exemplary \"Promotionsordnung\", which contain the rules for getting the \"Dr. jur.\": http://www2.jura.uni-halle.de/download/allgemein/gesetze/pro...
The German masters programs (LL.M.) have their own (not quite as gnarly) thesis papers to write.
:-)
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Note added at 3 hrs 46 mins (2004-10-19 23:00:53 GMT) Post-grading
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The process of getting this title (\"Dr. jur.\") takes 2-5 years...
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Note added at 3 hrs 19 mins (2004-10-19 22:33:58 GMT)
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Sorry, I got carried away, the link: http://www.payscale.com/salary-survey/aid-29713/raname-SALAR... ;-)
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Note added at 3 hrs 45 mins (2004-10-19 22:59:51 GMT) Post-grading
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Thanks, but I think you are wrong about a German \"Dr. jur.\" not having to write a thesis.
I have just (less than a month ago) passed the second of both state exams (after two years of post-graduate legal clerkship) and am now a German attorney and (if I were a German citizen) could become a judge, but I am not a \"Dr. jur.\".
If I wanted to become a \"Dr. jur.\", I would have to (and still could) find a \"Doktorvater\", with whom I would decide upon a theme for my \"Doktorarbeit\" = \"thesis\". At the end there would be a so-called \"Rigorosum\", which is basically a huge oral exam. And then to top it all off, the thing would have to be published (\"für ein Heidengeld\"). Then, and only then, would I be entitled to carry the title of \"Dr. jur.\" (see \"Dissertation\" in this exemplary \"Promotionsordnung\", which contain the rules for getting the \"Dr. jur.\": http://www2.jura.uni-halle.de/download/allgemein/gesetze/pro...
The German masters programs (LL.M.) have their own (not quite as gnarly) thesis papers to write.
:-)
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Note added at 3 hrs 46 mins (2004-10-19 23:00:53 GMT) Post-grading
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The process of getting this title (\"Dr. jur.\") takes 2-5 years...
2 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Sorry to inform you that you're wrong. A German law student is not required to write a thesis either. A German law student has to pass the "Staatsexamen," similar to a US law student passing the Bar Exam, which in most instances is significantly harder. Furthermore, many times a Master's Degree (which you receive upon completing a thesis) is prerequisite for entering law school. Only in a few instances do US law schools accept a student without a Master's degree.
"
+4
3 mins
I'd say yes.
JD after all is in Latin.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Leo3 (X)
4 mins
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| agree |
Kim Metzger
: For the US: http://www.law.yale.edu/outside/html/Academics/acad-joint.ht...
6 mins
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| neutral |
Derek Gill Franßen
: I'd probably say "no". I think they are two different things (see the first and last paragraphs of Kim's link).
25 mins
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| agree |
Andras Malatinszky
1 hr
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| agree |
Dr. Fred Thomson
: 3 years of post BA/BS study is required for the JD; Some unis allow for additional MAs or PhDs in specialized areas of law, but IMO the JD = dr. jur.
2 hrs
|
+4
4 mins
Edith Kelly
Switzerland
Switzerland
Native in German
&
English
Specializes in field
Switzerland
Professional conference interpreter
Native in: German 
, English
Works in: German to English, English to German, Dutch to German, and 4 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
396
Doctor of Laws (LLD)
if you absolutely need to translate
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Kim Metzger
: For GB, Canada, etc. I'm not sure if it's used in the US.
7 mins
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Thanks Kim, but .... my US English is not the best .... America and England (in my case Ireland) are one nation divided by a common language. I cannot remember the origin of that quote.
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| agree |
Dr. Fred Thomson
: Agree with Kim: not correct for US
9 mins
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Thanks. Please see my comment to Kim's agree.
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| agree |
lafresita (X)
11 mins
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Thanks.
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| agree |
Derek Gill Franßen
: Yes, in America "PhD in Law" or "Doctorate of/in Law". In Germany one can get a PhD after the 1st state exam (which ends the studies at the University = B.A.?) and before or after the 2nd state exam (which is required to become an attorney = J.D.?). :-)
21 mins
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Thanks Derek, tough one.
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| neutral |
Andras Malatinszky
: The quote about America and England being divided by a common language is by GB Shaw, Edith. Derek: No, in the US a PhD in Law is different from a Juris Doctor.
1 hr
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+1
1 hr
Andras Malatinszky
Native in: Hungarian
Works in: Hungarian to English, English to Hungarian, German to English, and 2 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
14
Juris Doctor
I don't know about the British system, but in the US if you want to become a lawyer, you get a bachelor's degree (BA/BS) first, then you go to law school and when you finish that, you become a juris doctor. A JD is *not* the same as a PhD, and while it's customary to address someone with a PhD as Doctor + <last name>, you would never call a lawyer with just a JD a "Doctor". Some lawyers go on to get a master's degree or a PhD if they are so inclined, and some law schools let you combine your regular law studies with master's or doctoral studies (as shown in the Yale Law link in another answer), but those are separate degrees nonetheless.
I vividly recall a conversation a few years ago with a neighbor of mine who was already a lawyer and who had just finished a master's in business law. He joked that lawyers are the only ones who get their master's after their doctorate.
I vividly recall a conversation a few years ago with a neighbor of mine who was already a lawyer and who had just finished a master's in business law. He joked that lawyers are the only ones who get their master's after their doctorate.
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Dr. Fred Thomson
: IMHO the form of address has no bearing here. The fact that the Germans call a dr. jur. Dr. sowieso doesn't matter. How much schooling it takes, does. Thanks for the additional info.
32 mins
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You are, of course, right. The reason I brought up the form of address, Dr. Thomson, is to emphasize the point that JD and PhD are not the same.
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| agree |
Derek Gill Franßen
: IMHO you are absolutely right. I do not claim that a "PhD" and a "JD" are the same, I merely claim that a German "Dr. jur." is not the same as an American "JD" (as was asked). :-)
2 hrs
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