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contrepointe
matières plastiques
Dec 28, 2020 09:39
3 yrs ago
59 viewers *
French term

nœud coulissant

French to English Other Sports / Fitness / Recreation knots
Recommendations for use of a diving marker buoy include how to attach the rope by means of a knot and carabiner.

Divers are instructed to: "effectuez un nœud coulissant et fixez le en dessous de la bouée à l'aide du mousqueton"

The above instruction corresponds to 00:15-00:30 of this video:
https://conseilsport.decathlon.fr/comment-utiliser-sa-bouee-...

Can anyone say if this 'nœud coulissant' is equivalent to a 'nœud coulant' and therefore a 'slip knot'? Some sources explicitly state that they are equivalent, whereas others inadvertently mix them up.

xxx
Proposed translations (English)
4 clove hitch
4 -1 sliding knot

Discussion

Nikki Scott-Despaigne Dec 31, 2020:
@Thomas The knot in your video is a "demi-clé" aka a "clove hitch". Sailing and diving are among my specialisations, from personal family and professional experience.
See my post with source below.
Note that the "hangman's knot" would never be used in your context of course! ;-)
Thomas Miles (asker) Dec 29, 2020:
Dear Daryo... Thank you for taking the time to watch the video and sharing your detailed knowledge of knots. In view of the discrepency between text and video, I have flagged this to the client.
Daryo Dec 28, 2020:
but ... what is shown in the video is a knot meant to hold tight, NOT to slide.

The video says nothing - just music. If this knot at 00:20 to 00:30 is meant to be "un nœud coulissant" (which would make sense if it's going to be used to move this bag filled with stones up and down) then it's NOT what is shown on this video.

This video is not going to impress anyone past beginner's level in ropework ...

BTW, there several knots that can "slide" - so without this video it would have been simply impossible to know which one is the one meant to be used (never mind the video showing the wrong knot).

One way or another, there is a discrepancy in this video.

If they wanted to put a knot that would hold the rope at the point marked with the black tape (i.e. no "sliding" of any kind intended) then what is shown in this video is the right knot, but it's given a wrong name.

If they really intended to put some kind of "sliding knot", what is shown in the video in 00:20 to 00:30 is for sure not that.

So, you will need some additional input from the client - so they make up their mind as to what is right - the knot shown on the video or the name given to it ... can't be both.
Daryo Dec 28, 2020:
There is no need to ask anything All you need is in this video.

There is a "bowline knot" in this video, but it's at 00:43 to 00:53 - you can clearly recognise it although the way it's presented you won't learn how to do it from this video.

The knot he's making at 00:20 to 00:30 is in fact a "clove-hitch" knot - a self-locking knot! - the more you pull, the better it holds. [ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clove_hitch ] If you make it over smooth metal, it just may slide but because of the friction of the rope on itself, the rope won't last very long.

There is a slightly different knot (looks almost like the "clove-hitch") that you put at the top of the rope on a carabiner and then you can control the movement of one strand by letting loose or holding the other strand - THAT would be the knot you would need to make in the part 00:20 to 00:30 and that one IS meant to slide and it's a The Munter hitch, (a.k.a the Italian hitch or the Crossing Hitch)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munter_hitch

So the knot you need as presented in this video is DEFINITELY a "Munter / Italian / Crossing Hitch" - if you want it to slide and be used to control the sinking of the bag filled with stones.
John Dawson Dec 28, 2020:
Slip-knot Slip-knot would seem an ideal choice for such purpose - simple to tie, quite secure, simple to untie later.
Thomas Miles (asker) Dec 28, 2020:
Althea: That is certainly a useful guide. I think it is clear by comparing the end result in the video and their image of a 'nœud coulissant' that we are not talking about a typical 'hangman's knot'.
Althea Draper Dec 28, 2020:
Quelques noeuds utiles Here's the difference according to this 'matelotage' site (pages 2, 3 and 6)
http://www.croisiere-catamaran.eu/wp-content/uploads/2015/11...
Tony M Dec 28, 2020:
@ Asker I cannot believe they would use a slip-knot for such a purpose — and it's most certainly not the same thing as a 'running knot'!

Proposed translations

-1
20 mins

sliding knot

Note from asker:
Massimo - questa pagina contiene i due termini ''nœud coulissant' e 'nœud coulant'!
Peer comment(s):
disagree Daryo : where do you see any "bracelet" in this story ???
13 hrs
Something went wrong...
3 days 3 hrs
French term (edited): noeud demi-clé

clove hitch

What you refer to in your video is what I know as a "noeud demi-clé" which I know as a "clove hitch". Indeed, I see no reference in your source to "noeud coulissant".
Unless I am mistaken, it seems that your starting point in the source is not correct.

If you are certain that the video at the point indicated is the knot you need the term for, then "clove hitch" is what is used. Here's a similar source, similar context, attaching a buoy with a carabiner for freediving.

(Note that a "noeud coulant" is known as a "running bowline" and again is different to the "bowline" which is commonly described as a "noeud de chaise". It is not the same thing as a "noeud coulissant".)

My dad sailed and I sailed with him a little as a child. My ex-husband was a professional ocean-racing yachtsman for a large part of his working life. The whole family had no choice but to learn a few knots ! I ended up knowing more knots in French.

If you are sure you need "noeud coulissant", then the video does not match your FR term. As before, possible confusion with "noeud coulant" (running bowline) but no signg of that one anyway so...).

Check this video in EN for knots used in freediving. The "clove hitch" at 3:50 is shon clearly and is an exact match for your source.
If you are working from an original text, then you might even discuss with your client whether they are sure about their choice of term.



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Note added at 3 days 3 hrs (2020-12-31 13:08:27 GMT)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHKj87VGEH0&ab_channel=Freed...


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Note added at 3 days 3 hrs (2020-12-31 13:09:14 GMT)
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Scratch the example sentence. Sorry. I've reposted the link in an additional Note.

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Note added at 3 days 3 hrs (2020-12-31 13:13:36 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

in context, "noeud demi-clé" would usually be referred to as "un demi-clé" alone.


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Note added at 3 days 3 hrs (2020-12-31 13:18:58 GMT)
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Sorry about Decathlon but as it is a multisport store, they do sometimes get the terminology wrong. Ideally, they'd have a specialist for each area but that's not possible, we know.
Example sentence:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHKj87VGEH0&ab_channel=FreedivePassion

Peer comment(s):
neutral Tony M : I think you're right, that it should be a running bowline, and the FR terms is probably just wrong. I don't believe it could be a clove hitch, which would hardly be suitable for the use described (whereas a bowline of either type + caribiner would be).
16 mins
When you compare the videos, there is no bowline (running or otherwise). There is not no bowline knot at the specific point referred to in the source video. ;-). There is an error in the source, thus my correction of the source term in this post's title.
Something went wrong...
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