Apr 27, 2020 09:31
4 yrs ago
53 viewers *
French term

édicule

French to English Tech/Engineering Construction / Civil Engineering
From a document setting out specifications for the construction of a private villa:

"Les dimensions des ascenseurs (intérieur de gaine, intérieur de cabine, dimensions de la fosse et hauteur sous dalle du dernier niveau) doivent être conformes à un modèle standard existant dans le commerce (1000kg, 1m/s, sans édicule, cabine avec grande hauteur)"

I think I understand that "édicule" refers to a free-standing external structure either at the bottom or the top of the elevator shaft (it is also used to refer to glass covers for metro stop entrances).

Any idea what this might be in English? And how "sans édicule" might be translated?

Discussion

Schtroumpf May 1, 2020:
Well yes I post short answers for sure, and even then people happen not to read all of the content with close attention.
Let this be a reminder for "keep it short"!
Einen schönen 1. Mai - bonne fête du travail à tous.
Johannes Gleim Apr 30, 2020:
@ Wiebke Sorry for having overseen this detail (was not 'underlined' by the reference link).
Schtroumpf Apr 30, 2020:
Please Johannes keep it simple!! Why, first of all, complain at Proz staff in order to make them hide my comment? I just indicated - once more, and have been doing so since years - that you might post much less Google results, considering that most of them have no link to the topic. Pls, once again Johannes, would you save our time when reading your input and eliminate non pertinent results from your answers?! You may refer to Kudoz netiquette in the rules part of this site.

Second point, my answer (I would not call that a proposal... mais passons) DOES integrate an English reference, which is VDI 2566-2 : 2004. So please, speak for yourself but leave me out of it.
Johannes Gleim Apr 30, 2020:
I summarize all proposals Marcos proposal: penthouse based on:
NFPA translation for ‘édicule’: penthouse
Termium Plus translations: aedicule, aedicule, edicule, kiosk, penthouse. bulkhead, roof-top enclosure.

My proposals: canopy supported by Merriam-Webster: Lexico, DGTI, Bay Area Rapid Transit, elevator manufactures, etc.

Schtroumpf’s proposal: machine room (incl. English version of German regulation),
modified by Mary: Machine-room-less elevator (no ref.),
also modified by Chris: elevator house (no ref. for ‘enclosure’)

Mrrafe: kiosk (some refs.)

The correct term depends on the target country (I suppose UK), the type, shape of the elevator and its 'edicule' and the location, purpose and shape.

Perhaps Ben may add this information.
Johannes Gleim Apr 28, 2020:
Avec Schtroumpf Sans salle des machines sur le toit. Cela semble évident et laisse de la place pour d'autres fins. Mais il n'est pas dit qu'il n'y a pas d'édicule, i.e. couverture ou toiture, par ex. en forme de pavillon, auvent ou marquise.
MRL elevator Machine-room-less elevators seems to be the most largely used term.
Kim Metzger Apr 27, 2020:
Définition édicule Edifice généralement de petite taille situé au dernier niveau d’un bâtiment, notamment sur la toiture terrasse, servant de local technique (machinerie d’ascenseur, moteurs de climatisation…). https://www.harmonie.fr/mini-lexique-etancheite-toiture-terr...
Kim Metzger Apr 27, 2020:
A mechanical room/machine room or a boiler room is a room or space in a building dedicated to the mechanical equipment and its associated electrical equipment, as opposed to rooms intended for human occupancy or storage. Unless a building is served by a centralized heating plant, the size of the mechanical room is usually proportional to the size of the building. A small building or home may have at most a utility room but in large buildings mechanical rooms can be of considerable size, often requiring multiple rooms throughout the building, or even occupying one or more complete floors (see: mechanical floor). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_room

Schtroumpf Apr 27, 2020:
Bonsoir L'ascenseur est dit "sans édicule" mais l'idée va plus loin que de ne pas avoir la "cabane" sur le toit - c'est un mode de construction particulier d'ascenseur, avec la partie machinerie logée dans la gaine. C'est peut-être pour cette raison que vous trouvez peu de pistes sur Google, Ben. Le local de machinerie n'est pas exactement la même chose que l'édicule, mais je devine que c'est l'absence de ce local qui est visée par le texte. Espérant que cela puisse vous aider !
Sebina Zisa-Davies Apr 27, 2020:
It sounds like a covered entrance, would "porch" do?

Proposed translations

+3
1 hr
Selected

(elevator) penthouse

See: https://books.google.ca/books?id=mmlWZMvt8-EC&pg=PA66&lpg=PA...
Termium also calls it "bulkhead" or "roof-top enclosure". See https://www.btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-eng.html?l...
I suppose it would be "lift" (rather than "elevator") in some parts of the world.
Peer comment(s):

agree EirTranslations
1 hr
agree Tony M
3 hrs
neutral writeaway : I don't see how your refs back this answer
6 hrs
agree K. Isaac
7 days
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
7 hrs

canopy

Preface:
I looked first for the term "édicule" and verified it function, shape and size. Then I looked for the appropriate translation and found the terms "kiosk", esp. the term "canopy" without referring to any other proposal prior to open the question and remarked that similar terms had already been disagreed being to big. In fact the term "canopy" does not determine the size. In order to prevent an additional disagree I consider it being useful to add this preface, prior to post man proposal.
See below:

1.1 Architecture A projection or shelter that resembles a roof.
‘they mounted the station steps under the concrete canopy’
1.2 The transparent plastic or glass cover of an aircraft's cockpit.
https://www.lexico.com/definition/canopy

2 : an ornamental rooflike structure
3a : the transparent enclosure over an airplane cockpit
b : the fabric part of a parachute that catches the air
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/canopy

Explanation:
Un édicule est un terme d'architecture qui recouvre plusieurs petites constructions isolées dans l'espace public ou des espaces ouverts, d'emploi et de statut variés.
:
Époque moderne
• Au XVIIIe siècle, en urbanisme et art des jardins, édicule désigne des constructions d'agrément dans les parcs et squares, sans doute plus fermées que les pavillons et kiosques et plutôt d'inspiration antique.
:
• Depuis le XIXe siècle, en urbanisme, édicule désigne de petites constructions dans l'espace public urbain (comme les vespasiennes, des colonnes Morris, des kiosques à journaux ou kiosques à musique, des bouches de métro couvertes, des abris, des volumes techniques). On retrouve l'association aux statues dans certaines, comme les fontaines Wallace.
• Dans les grandes villes, les édicules protègent des intempéries les escaliers comme ceux des bouches du métro.
Édicule moderne de la station de métro De La Savane, à Montréal.
L'un des fameux fosteritos, édicules du métro de Bilbao créés par Sir Norman Foster.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Édicule

Édicule d'Hector Guimard, dit La libellule.
• l'accès 3 « Boulevard de l'Amiral-Bruix », constitué d'un escalier fixe coiffé du seul édicule Guimard originel avec marquise de style Art nouveau, se situant face à la place des Généraux-de-Trentinian du côté pair de l'avenue Foch ;
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porte_Dauphine_(métro_de_Paris...

• entrance 3 - Boulevard de l'Amiral-Bruix, consisting of a fixed staircase topped with the only original Guimard kiosk with a canopy in the Art Nouveau style, located opposite the Place des Généraux-de-Trentinian on the even side of the Avenue Foch;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porte_Dauphine_(Paris_Métro)

marquise f de gare / station canopy o. awning | ~ de trottoir (ch.d.fer) / platform shelter, platform roofing
(Dictionnaire Général de la Technique Industrielle)

TDI : Habillage de cabine ascenseur, édicule ascenseur, tôlerie et charpente métallique
Elle propose notamment l'habillage de cabine ascenseur, l'installation d'édicule ascenseur en inox ou acier, de pylône ascenseur, ou ébrasement de porte
http://www.tdi-tolerie.com/

Those transferring from buses will not be using this new entrance. In fact, this new édicule will essentially be used by residents East of the station and people with mobility issues who need the elevators.
:
Current plan vs current plan removing all the walls inside the proposed edicule.
Imagine all the space and light opened up by using a shared concourse! (1m grid)
http://www.cat-bus.com/2017/03/the-new-vendome-station-long-...

It's a project that Metro announced in April of last year. The plan was to install a vaulted glass and steel canopy over the Dupont Circle station's north entrance, to protect both customers and the escalators from negative impacts of rain, ice, and snow.
https://wjla.com/news/local/metro-bankrupt-contractor-escala...

BART designing prototype escalator canopy to protect customers, employees and machinery
:
BART is in the design phase of a project to install a canopy over an entrance to 19th Street Station in Oakland in an effort to protect customers, employees and the escalators themselves.
https://www.bart.gov/news/articles/2013/news20130627

BART will also install 22 canopies at its downtown San Francisco stations from Embarcadero through Civic Center.
https://www.bart.gov/news/articles/2017/news20171017

The canopy of the lift can be used as an additional parking space or can be designed as lawn. Otherwise one can use paving, tiles, asphalt, concrete or simply metal as floor covering.
https://www.nani.de/products/lifting-equipment/car-lifts-and...

Canopy: The upper platform assembly that travels above the uppermost landing when the lift is raised, and lowers into a recess/opening in the upper landing floor when lowered.
:
6.1.1 Hydraulic Design Carriage and canopy platforms are actuated by four vertical hydraulic ram cylinders which raise and lower the lift platforms within four vertical guide angles attached to the building structure.
https://www.mckinleyelevator.com/app/uploads/2015/10/Vasari-...

The fire progagation was assisted by the 225 square foot ventilation shaft created when the rooftop elevator canopy was cleaned out during standard firefighting operations.
https://books.google.de/books?id=_AZxc6FS8I0C&pg=PA8&lpg=PA8...

Abstract:
The present invention provides improved elevator door hatches. … The door hatch also allows for the drop ceiling to be mounted closer to the canopy, which increases the usable height of the elevator cab.
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2018/0105394.html
Something went wrong...
+1
8 hrs

machine room

L'aspect des ascenseurs sans édicule est assez surprenant :
https://www.emrascenseurs.com/details-creation d un ascenseu...

Apparemment, l'édicule est la construction hors œuvre qui émerge du toit et qui sert à loger la partie d'entraînement :
"L’ascenseur / Comment ça marche / Les nouvelles technologies
Contenu

1. La connaissance de l’ascenseur (technologie) :
• Les ascenseurs électriques :
 avec local machinerie (en édicule)
 sans local machinerie (en gaine).
• Les ascenseurs hydrauliques.
• Les nouvelles technologies permettant à l’ascenseur de s’inscrire dans la démarche du développement durable (variation de fréquence avec réjection de courant)...."
https://www.nouvelleviepro.fr/formation/fiche/lascenseur-com...

On trouve une VDI allemande, titre en français :
"VDI 2566-2:2004 Conception acoustique pour ascenseurs sans local de machines" ou, en anglais,
"VDI 2566-2 : 2004 ACOUSTICAL DESIGN FOR LIFT SYSTEMS WITHOUT MACHINE ROOM"

J'ajoute la référence de cette illustration, où on voit très bien l'aspect "cabane sur le toit" - suivre la flèche "Triebwerksraum":
https://www.ditzingen.de/fileadmin/Dateien/Dateien/Feuerwehr...
Peer comment(s):

agree Kim Metzger : Edifice généralement de petite taille situé au dernier niveau d’un bâtiment, notamment sur la toiture terrasse, servant de local technique (machinerie d’ascenseur, moteurs de climatisation. https://www.harmonie.fr/mini-lexique-etancheite-toiture-terr...
1 hr
Merci, cher Kim !
Something went wrong...
21 hrs
French term (edited): ascenseur sans édicule

machine-room-less elevator

I'm no expert but this seems to be the most widely used term
Peer comment(s):

neutral Schtroumpf : "Sans édicule" may well be "machine-room-less" hence I already suggested "édicule = machine room"...
42 mins
You should have agreed then ;) MLR elevator seems to be the accepted term
Something went wrong...
-1
2 hrs

kiosk

In USA it would be kiosk, same as at the metro (USA subway). I think this is it (elevator, small villa)

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Glass-Elevator-Small-...

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Note added at 2 hrs (2020-04-27 12:03:48 GMT)
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Kiosk also is a free-standing enclosure for signage, e.g., at an elevator: https://touchsource.com/products/

Same word as metro kiosk: https://gvshp.org/blog/2012/10/04/historic-station-sequel/

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Note added at 23 hrs (2020-04-28 08:31:22 GMT)
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Tony M, I should have been clearer. I was suggesting that if kiosk is a synonym for edicule as a hut (per Asker's original suggestion), that's a possible source of confusion because a kiosk in EN may be two entirely different things which both coincidentally are found around elevators: the hut as on the Budapest/NYC metro, or free-standing encased signage which can be an elevator signaling panel separate from the wall but has nothing to do with huts. In fact I'm not even sure which of the two things the ST is referring to. Many FR-captioned pictures of elevator edicules seem to involve both kiosk huts and signage kiosks.
Peer comment(s):

disagree Tony M : But not applicable here, for the little 'hut' that sticks up above the roof to house the lift gear.
1 hr
Something went wrong...
1 day 1 hr

elevator house /enclosure

Is what the firemen seem to call it...

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=i4bmE2TqY6sC&pg=PA338&lp...

https://books.google.de/books?id=6lgsMTl3IfQC&pg=PA52&lpg=PA...
....the little 'hut' that sticks up....

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Note added at 1 day 1 hr (2020-04-28 11:10:53 GMT)
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Something that looks similar(ish) to this:

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