Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
agriculture extensible
English translation:
extensive agriculture
Added to glossary by
Diana Huet de Guerville
Sep 4, 2012 15:08
12 yrs ago
1 viewer *
French term
agriculture extensible
French to English
Science
Environment & Ecology
"L’agriculture est essentiellement extensible, fondée sur le déboisement et le prélèvement abusif sur les ressources naturelles."
From a document describing the impact of various activities on the ecosystem. I've poked around on the internet and found several uses of this term, but can't figure out what the English would be. It sounds like it might be "subsistence agriculture," but that doesn't fit all the examples I've found so I'm not sure.
Any ideas?
From a document describing the impact of various activities on the ecosystem. I've poked around on the internet and found several uses of this term, but can't figure out what the English would be. It sounds like it might be "subsistence agriculture," but that doesn't fit all the examples I've found so I'm not sure.
Any ideas?
Proposed translations
(English)
3 | extensive agriculture |
Catharine Cellier-Smart
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4 +1 | agriculture can be extended |
B D Finch
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2 +2 | essentially, agriculture can be expanded, through... |
Aisha Maniar
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4 | extendable agriculture |
Alan Douglas (X)
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4 -1 | exhaustible agriculture |
Natalie Pavey (X)
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4 -1 | boundless |
cc in nyc
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Proposed translations
21 mins
Selected
extensive agriculture
Although "agriculture extensive" exists in French I believe this is the correct translation here.
see also
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extensive_farming
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Note added at 25 mins (2012-09-04 15:34:07 GMT)
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see also on Termium (http://btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-eng.html?lang=e... and IATE (http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
see also
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extensive_farming
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Note added at 25 mins (2012-09-04 15:34:07 GMT)
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see also on Termium (http://btb.termiumplus.gc.ca/tpv2alpha/alpha-eng.html?lang=e... and IATE (http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
Note from asker:
looks good to me, simpler than I thought! |
Peer comment(s):
agree |
kashew
: Looks conclusive, but the Fr is "extensible".
1 min
|
I know, but even so I believe extensive is right here - see my Termium and IATE refs.
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neutral |
Bertrand Leduc
: I do not think so, the term ''agriculture extensive'' exist as well in French, same meaning!
16 mins
|
I mentioned in my answer that ''agriculture extensive'' also exists in French, but to my mind that doesn't mean "agriculture extensible" doesn't translate as "extensive agriculture"
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neutral |
nweatherdon
: it seems that the use in this case appears to differ from that in the wikipedia article you mention
3 hrs
|
I don't think it differs
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disagree |
cc in nyc
: French source text says "extensible," but the French version of Wiki you cite is "Agriculture extensive": http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agriculture_extensive . The Termium entry is also "agriculture extensive."
1 day 31 mins
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "This one seems to fit the best, and when I asked the client he said it made sense to him! So this is what I used in the document. But it's a weird one, it sounds like the French terms 'agriculture extensive' and 'extensible' might be synonyms? It's a mystery...
Thanks to everyone for all your input! "
+2
26 mins
essentially, agriculture can be expanded, through...
from my reading of the scant context you've provided, the word you are actually looking for a translation of is "extensible" - does the phrase "agriculture extensible" appear as such elsewhere in your text?
The sentence you've given (and I can only base my answer on that) seems to imply that agriculture "grows" at the expense of other ecosystems/natural habitats.
Perhaps I'm reading this all wrong though...
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Note added at 2 hrs (2012-09-04 17:37:12 GMT)
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based on your further context, I would suggest something like "haphazard farming". I don't think "extensive farming" would work here
The sentence you've given (and I can only base my answer on that) seems to imply that agriculture "grows" at the expense of other ecosystems/natural habitats.
Perhaps I'm reading this all wrong though...
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Note added at 2 hrs (2012-09-04 17:37:12 GMT)
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based on your further context, I would suggest something like "haphazard farming". I don't think "extensive farming" would work here
Peer comment(s):
neutral |
Bertrand Leduc
: I share the same understanding, however, I don't see how your answer would fit here!
16 mins
|
I suspect something more punchy is needed here, but that would depend on further context, as agriculture unto itself isn't a bad thing; it would depend on the overall tone and style of the text
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|
agree |
Rachel Fell
: maybe something like"it is in the nature of agriculture to expand, through...". I see what you mean, hadn't read it all. "Unrestrained agriculture" perhaps?
4 hrs
|
thanks, Rachel, however, "expand" was based on the initial context given, I've now changed that to "haphazard" with the additional context provided; it is expanding but it's the nature of that expansion that is the issue
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agree |
cc in nyc
: I think that "can be expanded" is the right direction // I don't see any linguistic basis for "haphazard" :-( // OK then; agree but just for "can be expanded"
23 hrs
|
With the further context, I think it works in some places but haphazard, used at least in food security in farming, seems, to me, to be more correct/I see what you mean:in the note above those are 'net sources, so yes "expanded" is the right direction :-)
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18 hrs
extendable agriculture
The area farmed is extendable, i.e. it can be extended by successive deforestation.
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Note added at 19 heures (2012-09-05 10:11:02 GMT)
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I did consider slash-and-burn agriculture which is what is being referred to here. However, that would back translate as agriculture sur brûlis or agriculture sur abattis-brûlis.
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slash-and-burn ;
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agriculture_sur_brûlis
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Note added at 19 heures (2012-09-05 10:19:06 GMT)
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See also:
Shifting cultivation, which would back translate as agriculture itinérante.
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agriculture_sur_brûlis ;
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agriculture_itinérante
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Note added at 19 heures (2012-09-05 10:27:28 GMT)
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That last reference should have been:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shifting_cultivation
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Note added at 19 heures (2012-09-05 10:11:02 GMT)
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I did consider slash-and-burn agriculture which is what is being referred to here. However, that would back translate as agriculture sur brûlis or agriculture sur abattis-brûlis.
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slash-and-burn ;
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agriculture_sur_brûlis
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Note added at 19 heures (2012-09-05 10:19:06 GMT)
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See also:
Shifting cultivation, which would back translate as agriculture itinérante.
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agriculture_sur_brûlis ;
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agriculture_itinérante
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Note added at 19 heures (2012-09-05 10:27:28 GMT)
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That last reference should have been:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shifting_cultivation
Peer comment(s):
disagree |
Natalie Pavey (X)
: Similar to my response to the cc in nyc's suggestion, forests and natural resources are in fact depleted by agriculture and not extended, as you suggest.
3 hrs
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I am not suggeting that forests and natural resources are not depleted but that the area given over to agriculture is extended. You have completely missread my point.
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agree |
cc in nyc
: "Extendible" is possible, but we don't see "slash-and-burn" or "shifting agriculture" (crop rotation) in the source text. // Fair enough.
5 hrs
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Which is why I said that I considered them. I did not propose either. My proposal was extendable agriculture. The rest was background.
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-1
42 mins
exhaustible agriculture
"Extensible" in this case refers to exhaustible natural resources and the agricultural practices surrounding them. The information on page 10 of my reference ("Exhaustible Agricultural Systems") may help you decide if this is what your text is referring to.
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Note added at 23 hrs (2012-09-05 14:26:59 GMT)
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I think the translation of this expression depends on the tone of the entire document. "Extendable" has a more positive connotation while "exhaustible" is rather negative. Given that the second half of this sentence refers to the depletion of natural resources, I believe the negative connotation is appropriate, but the rest of the text must be considered as well.
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Note added at 23 hrs (2012-09-05 14:26:59 GMT)
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I think the translation of this expression depends on the tone of the entire document. "Extendable" has a more positive connotation while "exhaustible" is rather negative. Given that the second half of this sentence refers to the depletion of natural resources, I believe the negative connotation is appropriate, but the rest of the text must be considered as well.
Peer comment(s):
disagree |
cc in nyc
: I see no relationship between your reference and the source text; what is the linguistic basis for your proposed answer?
22 hrs
|
-1
1 hr
French term (edited):
extensible
boundless
Based on the idea of "open-ended" for "extensible":
Agriculture (or perhaps farming) is essentially boundless ...
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Note added at 1 hr (2012-09-04 17:00:10 GMT)
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References to "open ended / open end" in IATE:
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
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Note added at 22 hrs (2012-09-05 14:07:05 GMT)
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For those who may not able to launch IATE links:
extensible
open ended
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
série extensible
open end series
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
And, for a bonus, from the TLFi:
extensible
B. Au fig.
1. Qui est susceptible de se développer, de prendre de plus en plus d'importance.
2. Qui peut s'appliquer à de nombreux éléments, qui peut englober d'autres choses.
http://www.cnrtl.fr/definition/extensible
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Note added at 23 hrs (2012-09-05 14:28:14 GMT)
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coquille: "may not be able"
Agriculture (or perhaps farming) is essentially boundless ...
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Note added at 1 hr (2012-09-04 17:00:10 GMT)
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References to "open ended / open end" in IATE:
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
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Note added at 22 hrs (2012-09-05 14:07:05 GMT)
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For those who may not able to launch IATE links:
extensible
open ended
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
série extensible
open end series
http://iate.europa.eu/iatediff/SearchByQuery.do?method=searc...
And, for a bonus, from the TLFi:
extensible
B. Au fig.
1. Qui est susceptible de se développer, de prendre de plus en plus d'importance.
2. Qui peut s'appliquer à de nombreux éléments, qui peut englober d'autres choses.
http://www.cnrtl.fr/definition/extensible
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Note added at 23 hrs (2012-09-05 14:28:14 GMT)
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coquille: "may not be able"
Peer comment(s):
disagree |
Natalie Pavey (X)
: On the contrary, I believe that "extensible" in this context means that the resources are essentially bounded by their exhaustibility. Forests and natural resources are in fact depleted by agriculture and not made infinite.
20 hrs
|
Au contraire, in the source text it is farming (l'agriculture) that is extensible, not forests and natural resources.
|
+1
1 day 1 hr
agriculture can be extended
Note that your source text says "L’agriculture est essentiellement extensible," which is true. It does not say "agriculture extensible", which is actually nonsense.
Not "expanded" because extending agriculture is about using more land, while agriculture can be "expanded" (though that is not a word that would be commonly used) by intensification, i.e. producing more from the same land area by altering techniques or inputs.
Not "expanded" because extending agriculture is about using more land, while agriculture can be "expanded" (though that is not a word that would be commonly used) by intensification, i.e. producing more from the same land area by altering techniques or inputs.
Peer comment(s):
agree |
cc in nyc
: also convincing
51 mins
|
Thanks cc. Given "fondée sur le déboisement ..." I am sure it is correct, especially as I used to work on publications in an agric. research centre.
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Discussion
Perhaps our FR writer has something in common with the Eggman :-)
@Wolf: you're right that we're just assuming that "extensible" and "extensive" have the same meaning in French, for now that seems like the easiest way to go. But if I ever come across a French agricultural expert, I'll be sure to ask! And I agree with your assessment that this text refers to the practices this particular community, which makes sense to me in this context since the residents in question rely heavily on natural resources and overexploit them - so extensive as in low-input and low-yield, but definitely not sustainable!
By the way the text is about climate change impact on ecosystems in Guinea-Bissau, don't know if that helps at all.
That's what I was kind of thinking with "encroaches on".
Diana, I know you've closed the question and awarded points, so any further discussion has no bearing on your work, but out of curiosity, where is the text based, in which region?
@ Diana, Catherine: me not an expert, and if the shoe fits...but I still have my doubts; extensible is a very specific term choice. Extensive in a farming context is simply the opposite of intensive; i.e. long-term and sustainable vs short-term and less sustainable. We still don't really know what "agriculture extensible" means, just assuming it's the same as extensive...hmmm.
But if the client's happy, that's what matters at the end, right :-) ?
@Wolf - yes the texts I cited seem to contradict each other, which is why I was confused about the meaning - but they're not from the same place (I should have made that more clear), they were more to show that this is indeed a term that is used in French.
I went back to the termium entry that Catherine provided (quoted below), and it does sound to me like extensive agriculture fits here. Plus the definition they provide makes sense and explains the contradictions a bit - it's good in that it uses less inputs (chemical and otherwise), but it's bad in that it takes up more land since the yield is lower - leading to deforestation etc., the problem cited in the source text.
termium:
"Extensive agriculture is distinguished from intensive agriculture in that the latter, employing large amounts of labour and capital, enables one to apply fertilizers, insecticides, fungicides, and herbicides and to plant, cultivate, and often harvest mechanically. Because extensive agriculture produces a lower yield per unit of land, its use commercially requires large quantities of land in order to be profitable."
How about encroachment, in the sense that agriculture encroaches on the natural environment?
Petit Robert defines extensible as "3. Qui, par sa généralité, sa souplesse peut s'appliquer à plusieurs choses, englober d'autres choses".
First, l'agriculture extensible is depleting natural resources, so it's perceived as bad; then, it doesn't use chemical products or pesticides and has a low yield, which would be seen as good in contrast to the abusive commercial agriculture; but then it's applied to irrigated lands that use up too much water, so it's bad again...
Is the writer confused, or am I? :-)
And I only have one page of the document for now, so no more examples to give, sorry!
1 / Agriculture de subsistance: Avant la révolution verte ou n’en bénéficie pas. Cette agriculture n’utilise pas les moyens modernes de production. Ils n’utilisent pas les engrais chimiques, ni de pesticides, ni de machines, investissement faible. Ils recourent à une agriculture extensible avec une production très faible."
and "Dans les zones arrosées ou irriguées, on pratique une agriculture extensible qui absorbe une grosse quantité d’eau, tandis que beaucoup de terres cultivables restent inexploitées."
and "En val inondable, les prairies ont disparu au profit des terres cultivées. Les parcelles s’agrandissent, conséquence du développement de l’agriculture extensible. Néanmoins, l’agriculture restant majoritaire et très présente, le paysage garde son caractère ouvert. Les boisements se densifient mais ces formations restent éparses."
A little more context: "Une grande majorité de cette population, parmi lesquels les femmes et les hommes ruraux sont très dépendants des services des écosystèmes pour se nourrir et générer des revenus (PANA, 2006). Ces services ecosystemiques connaissent actuellement un état de dégradation alarmant. L’agriculture est essentiellement extensible, fondée sur le déboisement et le prélèvement abusif sur les ressources naturelles, qui sont aussi surexploitées et menacés de disparition. Cela se traduit par un niveau de déforestation très élevé et perte considérable en biodiversité."
Here are a few descriptions I've found online:
Under the heading "agriculture de subsistence" : "Avant la révolution verte ou n’en bénéficie pas. Cette agriculture n’utilise pas les moyens modernes de production. Ils n’utilisent pas les engrais chimiques, ni de pesticides, ni de machines, investi