Dec 22, 2011 17:41
12 yrs ago
French term
Spain
20 years producing 100% natural English
Native in: English (Variant: British) 
Works in: English, French to English
thuillier
French to English
Marketing
Tourism & Travel
website for Jura campsite
There are plenty of cases of Mr and/or Mrs Thuillier on the web, but apart from them there is only the site I'm translating. It's in quotes and I imagine it must be a local word for a 'fumoir' but I certainly can't find any proof of that - unless it's a typo, of course.
The context:
De nombreuses tables jurassiennes présentent une cuisine traditionnelle ou originale, avec des plats typiques ou inventifs, à partir des produits locaux : vins, fromages, truites de nos rivières, charcuterie fumée dans les *** « thuilliers » *** de montagne...
Thanks for your help.
Sheila
The context:
De nombreuses tables jurassiennes présentent une cuisine traditionnelle ou originale, avec des plats typiques ou inventifs, à partir des produits locaux : vins, fromages, truites de nos rivières, charcuterie fumée dans les *** « thuilliers » *** de montagne...
Thanks for your help.
Sheila
Proposed translations
(English)
| 5 | tuyé (attic) |
jasonwkingsley
|
| 5 +3 | typical local chimney |
Tony M
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| 4 | smokehouse |
ACOZ (X)
|
| 4 -1 | Tuilier kiln (with or without gloss maybe) |
Lara Barnett
|
Proposed translations
17 mins
jasonwkingsley
United States
United States
Native in English
Works in field
United States
Good understandable English with style.
Native in: English
Works in: French to English, Spanish to English, Italian to English
Related KudoZ points
:
4
Selected
tuyé (attic)
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuyé
This is the french word you are looking for. You might want to '....' the word or find a suitable translation. Attic might work.
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Note added at 21 mins (2011-12-22 18:02:46 GMT)
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As you can see, it also has different spellings. In any case, you're a pro so you'll find a good word. It's quite an amazing process. The picture is fantastic.
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Note added at 28 mins (2011-12-22 18:10:05 GMT)
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I wouldn't say it's an attic. More like a 'hearth where you smoke meat'...you're a seasoned translator, I'm sure you'll find something good. But what a typo !
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Note added at 34 mins (2011-12-22 18:16:30 GMT)
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I think you should definitely say tuyé with a translation that explains it's structure. A chimney like Tony said.
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Note added at 2 hrs (2011-12-22 19:55:22 GMT)
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I don't know if this is really a 'chimney'. There isn't really a fire involved, just smoke.
Maybe you could describe it as 'a unique giant smokestack with a an open attic' I thought of attic because of the rafters or beams up above where the smoke escapes.
This is the french word you are looking for. You might want to '....' the word or find a suitable translation. Attic might work.
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Note added at 21 mins (2011-12-22 18:02:46 GMT)
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As you can see, it also has different spellings. In any case, you're a pro so you'll find a good word. It's quite an amazing process. The picture is fantastic.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 28 mins (2011-12-22 18:10:05 GMT)
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I wouldn't say it's an attic. More like a 'hearth where you smoke meat'...you're a seasoned translator, I'm sure you'll find something good. But what a typo !
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Note added at 34 mins (2011-12-22 18:16:30 GMT)
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I think you should definitely say tuyé with a translation that explains it's structure. A chimney like Tony said.
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Note added at 2 hrs (2011-12-22 19:55:22 GMT)
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I don't know if this is really a 'chimney'. There isn't really a fire involved, just smoke.
Maybe you could describe it as 'a unique giant smokestack with a an open attic' I thought of attic because of the rafters or beams up above where the smoke escapes.
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Proof that the word exists (however you spell or pronounce it) is what I needed. Thanks to all for your help"
-1
2 hrs
Lara Barnett
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Native in English
Specializes in field
United Kingdom
www.lingocraft.co.uk
Native in: English (Variants: Singaporean, UK, South African, British, Scottish, Irish)
Works in: French to English, Italian to English, Romanian to English, and 2 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
12
Tuilier kiln (with or without gloss maybe)
This could be a misspelling for the "four de Tuilier" (rather than "Th..."). These were kilns where Romans fired their tiles and seem to be located around France-comte, where mountains of the Jura are located.
These websites show some images and descriptions of what this is all about:
http://www.geolocation.ws/v/P/14671935/nermier-four-de-tuili...
http://www.gralon.net/tourisme/a-visiter/info-le-four-de-tui...
"Voici une question peu banale : savez-vous comment les Gallo-Romains fabriquaient leurs tuiles ? La réponse se trouve au four de tuilier de Villers-Farlay. Daté du iie siècle, c’est un des plus anciens mis au jour en France."
http://www.balado.fr/loisirs-balades/39600-villers-farlay/ar...
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Note added at 2 hrs (2011-12-22 20:11:35 GMT)
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I suggested the gloss due to the fact that these were kilns historically. In the light of B D Finch's comment, I now believe that my suggestion of (with or without gloss...) should now read as (with gloss)
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Note added at 3 hrs (2011-12-22 20:42:55 GMT)
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Maybe a Tuilier smoker... (In the light of the disagree to kiln+glossl)
These websites show some images and descriptions of what this is all about:
http://www.geolocation.ws/v/P/14671935/nermier-four-de-tuili...
http://www.gralon.net/tourisme/a-visiter/info-le-four-de-tui...
"Voici une question peu banale : savez-vous comment les Gallo-Romains fabriquaient leurs tuiles ? La réponse se trouve au four de tuilier de Villers-Farlay. Daté du iie siècle, c’est un des plus anciens mis au jour en France."
http://www.balado.fr/loisirs-balades/39600-villers-farlay/ar...
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Note added at 2 hrs (2011-12-22 20:11:35 GMT)
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I suggested the gloss due to the fact that these were kilns historically. In the light of B D Finch's comment, I now believe that my suggestion of (with or without gloss...) should now read as (with gloss)
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Note added at 3 hrs (2011-12-22 20:42:55 GMT)
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Maybe a Tuilier smoker... (In the light of the disagree to kiln+glossl)
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
B D Finch
: You'd get a burnt offering instead of ham if you tried smoking meat in a kiln! The construction of a kiln is not suitable for smoking meat, so it is extremely unlikely that this is what is meant.
2 mins
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That does not mean they are still used as kiln's, which is why I suggested the gloss if necessary.
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| disagree |
Tony M
: Although there is v. likely an etymological connection between the 2, I think 'kiln' is too far from the present-day function / Fine, but you're replacing one unknown FR term with another one before glossing & I really can't support the use of 'kiln'.
22 mins
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Which is why I suggested the gloss - to explain the history of the term. / Tuilier smoker?
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5 hrs
smokehouse
The word "smokehouse" is commonly used as this form of kiln for smoking fish or meat. I would add brackets and put (traditionally called a "thuillier"). That way, tourists will recognised the word when they see it but still know what exactly it means.
+3
20 mins
typical local chimney
It's not a typo, just a regional (phonetic) spelling; I researched 'tuyé' and found this:
"Les Fermes à tuyé sont des habitations typiques de la région. Ces fermes sont de taille importante car elles devaient protéger les hommes et les animaux pendant tout l’hiver. On appelait « tuyé » l'immense cheminée en bois pyramidale sur le toit, mais aussi la pièce qui servait jadis de fumoir."
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franche-Comté
And I got there having found this site when I searched for 'thuillier':
http://monjura.actifforum.com/t73-le-tuye-de-papy-gaby-gille...
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Note added at 1 hr (2011-12-22 18:48:01 GMT)
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Although the FR word 'cheminée' is ambiguous, and a bit of a faux ami, inasmuch as it considers both the fireplace and the chimney as one entity, here I suppose 'fireplace' is nearer to what you need — though thinking about it, we do say "...hanging to smoke over the fire in the chimney", don't we?
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Note added at 2 hrs (2011-12-22 20:33:10 GMT)
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Working on the assumption that 'thuillier' is in fact just a variant of 'tuyé', whose pronunciation has undoubtedly changed down the centuries (and probably even from village to village!), the descriptions of Franche-Comtois farmhouses mentions the fact that the house is 'built around this huge pyramidal chimney/fireplace' and that the 'chimney can be seen on the roof'.
Clearly the smoking bit takes place in the 'fireplace' end, but as I mentioned above, no distinction is made in FR between the bottom and top end of a chimbley, and I think this is acceptable too in EN when talking about this kind of cottage-industry activity — sounds almost seasonably Dickensian, in fact!
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Note added at 1 day19 hrs (2011-12-24 12:48:40 GMT) Post-grading
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Great, thanks Sheila, glad it was some help!
Season's Greetings to all!
"Les Fermes à tuyé sont des habitations typiques de la région. Ces fermes sont de taille importante car elles devaient protéger les hommes et les animaux pendant tout l’hiver. On appelait « tuyé » l'immense cheminée en bois pyramidale sur le toit, mais aussi la pièce qui servait jadis de fumoir."
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franche-Comté
And I got there having found this site when I searched for 'thuillier':
http://monjura.actifforum.com/t73-le-tuye-de-papy-gaby-gille...
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Note added at 1 hr (2011-12-22 18:48:01 GMT)
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Although the FR word 'cheminée' is ambiguous, and a bit of a faux ami, inasmuch as it considers both the fireplace and the chimney as one entity, here I suppose 'fireplace' is nearer to what you need — though thinking about it, we do say "...hanging to smoke over the fire in the chimney", don't we?
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2011-12-22 20:33:10 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Working on the assumption that 'thuillier' is in fact just a variant of 'tuyé', whose pronunciation has undoubtedly changed down the centuries (and probably even from village to village!), the descriptions of Franche-Comtois farmhouses mentions the fact that the house is 'built around this huge pyramidal chimney/fireplace' and that the 'chimney can be seen on the roof'.
Clearly the smoking bit takes place in the 'fireplace' end, but as I mentioned above, no distinction is made in FR between the bottom and top end of a chimbley, and I think this is acceptable too in EN when talking about this kind of cottage-industry activity — sounds almost seasonably Dickensian, in fact!
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Note added at 1 day19 hrs (2011-12-24 12:48:40 GMT) Post-grading
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Great, thanks Sheila, glad it was some help!
Season's Greetings to all!
Note from asker:
| Thanks for the Papu Gaby link, Tony - the video there was very useful |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
jmleger
: way to go
13 mins
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Thanks, JM!
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| neutral |
jasonwkingsley
: I disagree to the fact that the original term 'thuillier' could be a regional or phonetic spelling. It is a spelling and/or badly researched error. 'ui' in French is always pronounced 'wee'. Tuyé is pronounced like tué.
15 mins
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Here in the Corrèze (also an almost mountainous region), th is pron. t and uill(i) y — hence you arrive exactly at 'tuyé'. Yes, but the 'y' sound is often almost swallowed, hardly there at all... the rapprochement is clear and obvious.
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| agree |
B D Finch
: Though there isn't much evidence for this being a local spelling, rather than just a mistake. Pronunciation certainly varies enormously, in Ariège older people often sound like they're speaking Spanish.
2 hrs
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Thanks, Barbara! Yes, here in Corrèze, we have a wide variety of pronunciations and spellings of words that are clearly etymologically related.
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| agree |
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
: No doubt the right solution. The original probably has an erroneous spelling. "tuyé" and "tuyau" , all to do with toobes. Chim chiminey Chim chiminey Chim chim cher-ee! ;-)//Must be a plumber somewhere called Thuillier!
18 hrs
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Thanks, Nikki! I find that lots of these words that date back into the dim and distant past of peasant life often have highly variant spellings, prob. bec. originally phonetic transcriptions, before sp. was standardized, though modern pron. diverges.
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