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Glossary entry

French term or phrase:

tirer les débutants vers le haut

English translation:

encouraging higher standards...

Added to glossary by Yvonne Gallagher
Nov 19, 2010 09:02
13 yrs ago
6 viewers *
French term

tirer les débutants vers le haut

French to English Social Sciences Education / Pedagogy Doctoral training
A text discussing new concepts in pluridisiplinary doctoral training. This passage is talking about providing some seminars jointly for master and doctorate students:

Un tel lissage des stades de formation présente l’avantage de tirer les débutants vers le haut

I can think of several colloquial ways of phrasing it (gets them to aim high; gives them something to aim for; gets the best from them) but the register here is formal.

There are a lot of "vers le haut" examples in the glossary but they mostly give "upwards" and I can't work that in here.

TIA
Proposed translations (English)
4 encouraging higher standards...
3 +1 Set the bar high for beginners
3 +1 bring the beginners to level
3 help/bring/enable beginners to make great strides
3 provides beginners with a high standard to work towards
3 providing beginners with high level experience
3 places beginners in a more challenging context
3 act as a stimulus for them
Change log

Nov 24, 2010 18:09: Yvonne Gallagher Created KOG entry

Discussion

Sheila Wilson (asker) Nov 19, 2010:
@ Nordiste Thanks for that, it's what I thought was true. However, although it may work in French my efforts in English so far clash horribly with the rest of the text. Thanks for all other input, too - I'm looking at all your good ideas now.
RUTH ELIZABETH BARTLETT Nov 19, 2010:
Sorry I just reread the source text and I think my overemphasis on standards was probably mistaken in the context.
RUTH ELIZABETH BARTLETT Nov 19, 2010:
Standards I see what you mean but I do think the concept of standards is relevant here as, to me, "tirer vers le haut" implies that the standards are set to "lift" people up to meet them. I think it needs an expression that combines "raising your game" with the concept of achievement but also there being an expectation of success. Although I don't have another suggestion!
Richard Nice Nov 19, 2010:
Redistribute? setting the bar high could be read two ways - either as a target set, or as a hurdle to be overcome early (the opposite of the intention?). Could you move the lissage notion to the upward movement (describe the reorganisation more neutrally) and then "ensures smooth upward progression" or some such?
nordiste Nov 19, 2010:
"tirer vers le haut " is not very formal "Tirer vers le haut" is a very common, not so formal register.
I suppose "to get the best out of them" is on a same level.
IMH French native Opinion

Proposed translations

14 hrs
Selected

encouraging higher standards...

Another suggestion and sample sentence
(It is hoped by)... grouping Ph.D and Masters candidates in these joint seminars...has the advantage of encouraging higher standards from novice researchers

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Note added at 5 days (2010-11-24 17:49:38 GMT) Post-grading
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glad to help
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thanks everyone for your help"
+1
6 mins

Set the bar high for beginners

I am not sure if this is still too colloquial for you? It is quite difficult to get away from that isn't it?
Peer comment(s):
agree Mark Bossanyi : I'd say entry level students rather than beginners
42 mins
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26 mins

help/bring/enable beginners to make great strides

make or achieve great progress

simpliste je sais, mais c'est ainsi que je lis la phrase
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46 mins

provides beginners with a high standard to work towards

beginners will not automatically BE better because they are exposed to difficult work and students of a higher level, but they will be encouraged to strive for rapid improvement. I think this is what "tirer vers le haut" means here.
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30 mins

providing beginners with high level experience

has the advantage of providing...etc.

Or "high level training" or "top level" something.

Or "gives beginners access to..."

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Note added at 1 hr (2010-11-19 10:43:16 GMT)
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Instead of beginners, you could say "research novices". I presume the common training is so that masters students get the benefit of training in research. PHD students already have some research experience.
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+1
2 hrs

bring the beginners to level

Je pense
Peer comment(s):
agree axies : to bring the beginners to '' a top/ high'' level. That should do.
1 day 20 hrs
Thanks Manuel
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4 hrs

places beginners in a more challenging context

Another possibility.
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2 hrs

act as a stimulus for them

motivate them
accelerate their learning curve


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Note added at 6 hrs (2010-11-19 15:51:07 GMT)
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give them a leg up
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