Glossary entry

Spanish term or phrase:

si la cosa se pierde (in this context)

English translation:

in the event of unforseen loss

Added to glossary by Adam Burman
Mar 9, 2007 23:11
17 yrs ago
1 viewer *
Spanish term

si la cosa se pierde (in this context)

Spanish to English Law/Patents Law: Contract(s) Incumplimiento de las obligaciones
I can't get my head around this sentence:

Consequences of arrears

Arroja el riesgo de la cosa sobre el deudor, pues por encontrarse en mora se estima que se halla en culpa. Tratándose del deudor moroso, es lógico considerar que si la cosa se pierde por caso fortuito, en cierta forma ha dado causa para ello, pues de haberla restituida en el momento en el que la deuda se hizo exigible, es seguro que el bien no hubiere perecido.

Can anyone shed any light on this?

Draft: Because the debtor has fallen into arrears, culpability is presumed and he bears the risk thereof (de la cosa). With regard to the bad debtor, it is logical to believe that if...

Many thanks

Discussion

Miguel Fuentes Mar 10, 2007:
With respect to your draft, I wouldn't use "thereof" here; it doesn't seem to fit logically. "Thereof" means "de ello" similar to "inherente a ello", but here they are talking about a material good (a car, an equipment , products, etc). Good luck!

Proposed translations

+4
1 hr
Selected

in the event of unforseen loss

A suggestion which I think tidies up the English into a neat legal sounding phrase
Peer comment(s):

agree Miguel Fuentes : You are right! there is no reference to force majeure in the context (now where the h did I got it?). To add to your answer I would suggest Act of God.
9 mins
Thanks, but fortuito means "accidental" I cannot see any reference to force majeure here (which is irresistible coercion or compulsion)
agree Cinnamon Nolan
7 hrs
agree Marisabel Maal : I completely agree with Miguel Fuentes. Acto fortuito = Act of God!
11 hrs
agree bluesky1
1 day 17 hrs
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thank you very much!"
12 mins

if it is lost fortuitously

Una opción.
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1 hr

if something is lost

My English is not the best as you know and laws are no my expertise but just an idea to clarify your ideas, then can you put them in "right" English... Hope it helps!

Tratándose del deudor moroso, es lógico considerar que si la cosa se pierde por caso fortuito, en cierta forma ha dado causa para ello, pues de haberla restituida en el momento en el que la deuda se hizo exigible, es seguro que el bien no hubiere perecido.

With regard to the bad debtor, it is logical to believe that if SOMETHING IS LOST by an act of God, in a certain form it is his (the bad debtor's) fault, because if he had restituted it at the moment at which the debt became due, the good will not have perished.

:)
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1 hr

if the chose is lost

cosa - chose, res. Cosa is a term of variable definition depending on the specific legal system. Among others, it may refer to any tangible object subject to valuation or to any tangible object regardless of susceptibility to valuation. Diccionario Juridico Cabanellas-Hoague.



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1 hr

if the matter is lost (ver expl.)

Aqui creo que casa se refiere a : cuestion, asunto, cosa, negocio..

Suerte!
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49 mins

if the thing is by chance/unforeseeably lost...

don't particularly like "the thing" but without further context...

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Note added at 3 hrs (2007-03-10 02:20:22 GMT)
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maybe "personal property" instead of "thing"
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1 hr

if the good is lost (due to force majeure)

Parece raro que usen "cosa" de esta forma en lenguaje jurídico. Sin embargo está bien claro que en tu texto se refieren a "bienes físicos" (goods).

Yo te aconsejo "force majeure" como sinónimo caso fortuito, porque se usa mucho más.

Saludos!

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Note added at 7 hrs (2007-03-10 06:53:39 GMT)
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Allegro tiene razón: No hay referencia directa a fuerza major. Aunque son virtualmente sinónimos.

Mi respuesta editada iría así: "If the good is lost due to an act of God/Force majeure"

Tanto en la ley común como la de código son sinónimos en el sentido de que los casos fortuitos, al imponerse sobre la situación y escapar del control de las partes, se convierten en fuerza mayor. (Louis A Robb Dict. Legal Terms isbn 968-18-0384-1) En un contrato de ley común normalmente en la seccion de force majeure se incluyen todos los casos de fuerza mayor y se incluyen actos de Dios, actos de gobierno, revueltas, etc. Mientras que en un contrato escrito bajo ley de código, generalmente basta con mencionar "Caso fortuito o de fuerza mayor" y la ley tiene una definición no sujeta a interpretación.

Bueno pues... suerte!
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